User blog:Tomahawk23/Germanic Ghost Warrior Vs. Hashashin



This is a battle between two highly skilled Midieval warriors who both utilized the method of ambush and stealth but in very different ways. One, a group of Germanic Warriors who ambushed and raided Roman camps, who's shields were so effective even the Romans adopted them. The other a group of highly trained killers who assassinated important political figures (including kings) in broad daylight and successfully alarmed Saladin not to invade the relms of their sect. In a battle between two great stealth fighters trained from birth, only one will survive, only one will taste victory, only one will be The Deadliest Warrior!

Germanic Ghost Warrior
Germanic Ghost Warriors were famous for night raids on Roman armies and camps, they got there name as "Ghosts" because there painted bodies and weapons black, so there were virtually invisible. Generally speaking they weren't fighting in open battles but function as gurilla fighters disrupting the enemy movments in an area. There were reportedly extremely capable with throw projectiles like Darts and Even Stones, and Roman even reported the Germanic Warriors could Throw a dart or spear as far as a bow could shot and arrow, although there is a reasonable explanation for this, small strands of leather or rope can be used like a small atlatl, allowing for darts to be thrown farther. Germaic Warriors were, as a general rule excellent spear fighters. Unlike other warriors, such as the Greeks, who generally used spears in formation fighting, The warriors of Germania used spears is single combat. Rather than straight foreword thrusting, the Germans used large swing circular motions, spinning them around there head, while slowly letting the spear slide further down there hand. This gives them the advantage of catching the enemy off guard by allowing the spear to strike further out than than they originally thought. In addition to there spear German warriors carried large oak shields to protect there body. While an effective companion with there spear, it works well with the Germanic short sword, which was basically a slightly larger version of the seax. This sword had a thick back allowing for a sturdier blade, bit also a very fine point, allow for stabs into armor gaps. Because of the blade short length when used the Germanic shield. Their shields were so effective that even the Romans tried to copy their shields. Germanic Warriors were trained at the youngest possible age, similar to Spartans, Samurai, and other warrior cultures. Their clubs were hardened in such away that they could not be cut in half, not at all.

Hashashin
Hashasins were a group of Arabic assassins who played a large role in the Crusades. They are famous for their military tactics. Assassinating important political figures, cut off the head and kill the body. They would often assert themselves in the town or region of their targets, and over time stealthily move themselves into strategic positions. They would assassinate their target in broad daylight generally infront of public crowds for intimidation purposes. They went in with no plans of escape, often giving their lives to kill their target, they even assassinated kings. The writings of Marco Polo depict the Hashasins as trained killers responsible for systematic elimination of opposing figures. Hashashins were fanatically loyal to their leader, carrying out his every order with out the single thought of questioning him or hesitation. They were often born into the order and trained from an extremely young age in the arts of combat, disguises, horseback riding, and code of conduct. They didn't always assassinate their targets, sometimes leaving a threatening note saying to follow their demands or be killed. The Hashashins reputation was so strong that these threats would often be taken seriously. An example of this is Saladin who barely managed to survive two assassination attempts on him from the Hashashins who made an alliance with them in order to avoid more assassination attempts. While the first two attempts did not kill him, they put him into an extreme state of paranioa. During the night in Saladin's conquest of Masyaf he awoke to find a figure leaving his tent and left a threatening note demanding he pulled out of Masyaf or else be killed. While Hashashins did not generally carry out upfront combat, it should be noted they fought upfront, an example of this would be in the conquest of Masyaf. They were highly proficient with swords, daggers, axes, throwing knives, use of shields, and other things.

X-factors
Germanic Ghost Warrior/Hashashin

Training/90/90

Both warrios here are extremely well trained. Both trained from birth in combat. It could be easily argued that Germanic Ghost Warriors were trained to fight upfront while Hashashins were all about the assassination. But Hashashins did fight in upfront combat sometimes. Such as in the conquest of Masyaf, why would they use shields if they never fought upfront?

Tactics/90/10

Tactics used by Hashashins were extremely effective, but in a one on one fight, or a squad on squad fight, what the hell is assassinating political and religious opponents gonna do other then intimidate the enemy? In this fight neither warrior will have knowledge of the other at all. 2,500 of these fights will take place in Masyaf in the day time, one on one. The other 2,500 in the forests of Germaniaa, squad on squad, under the cover of night. In day time one on one the Germanic tactics won't be very effective, at night 5 on 5 the German's tactics will so blow the Hashashins away. Easily ambushing them and quickly disposing of them.

Creativity/Resilience/85/90

Hashashins never went into their target's city with weapons. They went into the city and picked up whatever weapon they could find. Often a Dagger in which they would tip with poison. Hashashins picked up on anything they could find, probably included improvised weaponry. German'c generally went into combat with weapons, and I doubt were ever put into a position where they had to improvise. Regardless with the kind of training they had they would be able to improvise if they needed.

Organization/90/96

Both groups were clearly highly organized. It took much organization and patience to plan those raids on Roman Camps and those assassinations. Hashashins would wait months, even years before reaching their target. However, while it took organization to pull off the attacks Germanic Warrios made, it took much more organization to plan those assassinations. Islamic Historian Bernard Lewis cites the roll of honor at Alamut containing the names of fifty well-performed assassinations of known political enemies during the thirty-five years reign of Hassan.

Ruthless/90/99

Both groups were highly ruthless. Hashashins would give their lives to assassinate their target, they would assassinate them with no plans of escape just to kill the target. They were fanatically loyal to their Grandmaster, carrying out his every order without question or hesitation. Germanic Warriors cut down Roman camps killing everyone inside, but that's nothing like getting to know your target and then killing him infront of many people with no plans of escape knowing you'll day. Nor were they as fanatically loyal to their superiors as the Hashashins were.

Germanic Ghost Warrior Argument: (By SWG)
While this fight would be a fairly close battle, I ultimatly think the Ghost Warrior would win in the end. This is for a number of reason. First and Formost is his position as a raider as opposed to Assassin. Assassin's no matter how bold there assassination attempts are, as a generaly rule, meant to kill a target with stealth, generally avoiding direct conflict is at all possible. Raiding on the other hand pretty much means you probably going to have to do some direct fighting, and would fight fully armed Roman soldiers, but in the case of the Ghost Warrior his raids were happening at night and using camouflage to hit hard and fast, then move away then strike again, but they are fighting enemies who are ready to fight. He's used to fighting in direct combat, the Hashashin would not be a used to it.

Then there is the equipment, the Ghost Warrior is generally bringing equipment more suited to battle than assassination. The Long sword is more versatile than the Scimitar, a straight sword is more capable of preforming stabs and thrusts and additionally the straight blade allows for it to parry attacks of other weapons. The Spear vs the Throwing knives. Throwing knives aren't really effective killing tools, like the Shurikan, there light and even less likely to hit blade first than a shurikan. There good distraction tools, but the Spear is more effective, it always lands point first and if a formidable melee weapon. The Club vs the Dagger, is actually a fairly even comparison, the club is bigger and carries a lot of blunt for trauma, but the poison dagger can poison the opponent, and the dagger itself can be quiet a deadly weapon. Finally we come to the shields, the Hashashin's shield is small and is good for deflecting and parrying, but the Germanic shield is bigger and will render the throwing knives virtually useless, counter the slashing motions of the scimitar and is quiet a danger weapon in it's own right with the steel boss. The Hashashin shield smaller size means it's harder for the Hashashin to guard his legs, something the Ghost Warrior won't have to worry about do to the size of the shield.

So while these two are both formidable warriors, the Ghost warriors direct fighting style and experience and equipment will carry him to victory in a close fight.

Hashashin Argument: (By me because I seriously couldn't find anyone else to do it)
This will be a very close fight but in the end the Hashashin will take it for a variety of reasons. Let's start by comparing weapons.

Hashashin shield Vs Germanic shield. The Germanic shield is larger and can protect more of the body. The Hashashin shield isn't that much smaller....but it's still quite smaller but allows for more mobility. Overall the larger Germanic shield will take the edge for larger size.

Poisoned Khanjar Vs Club. The Poisoned Kanjar will take this. The club is designed in a way so it can't be cut in half. It can only kill if it hits the head, anywhere else is really just a broken bone. It can be easily blocked, and easily disarmed. The Khanjar is much more versital. It's designed in a way where it can give a very good stab or slash. It can easily block and counter the club. The Khanjar can also be thrown or used in a way where it's not for killing but for some other purpose.

Scimitar Vs Germanic Sword. Scimitar takes this easily. Now, it should be noted that the longer blade won't be much a thing. You see, the back of the blade of a Scimitar isn't sharp. Scimitar wielders would hold the blade to them putting their arms on the blade and get close for the kill. They would push in using it as a defense and then out of nowhere with the advantage of the curved blade strike at the opponent in a place where they weren't expecting it. It can giv great slashes and still a good thrust. Its curved blade can go under the Germanic's shield while the Hashashin blocks the Germanic's other weapon with his shield. It can easily cut the Germanic's spear right in half. Another thing, Germanic's aren't use to dealing with opponents with curved blades. No as a matter of fact, the Germanic's fought the Romans who used basically the swords the Germanic's used. Short, double edged, straight swords, good for stabbing, decent slashes, good for parrying, often used in combination with a shield etc. The Germanic Warrior will really be unfarmiliar with dealing with a curved blade like that. They'll be like "WTF how the hell do I defend against this thing". The Hashashins have actually dealt with straight swords quite a bit. Not the kind of straight swords the Germanic's used but the kind the Crusaders used. While there were quite some differences, it's not to hard to figure out how to defend against the Germanic's sword when you deal with Crusader swords.

Throwing Knives Vs Spear. Throwing Knives won't be very useful when the Germanic Warrior has his shield; he can easil block them. But the Germanic Warrior won't use his spear and shield at once. Germanic's didn't use the standard style of spear and shield. They generally wieled it with two hands, twirling it in the air and then all of the sudden striking. They used it in a slashing style more so then stabbing.The unique style of twirling it will confuse the Hashashin. Although he will probably just cut it in half with his Scimitar at a range. The Germanic Warrior will actually be at a disadvantage with his spear though. The Hashashin can take advantage of this by throwing his knives at the Germanic Warrior. Without his shield he's basically defenseless against them. Basically, the spear can be cut in half by the Scimitar; or the Hashashin can just throw his throwing knives and get him. So pitted against the spear throwing knives win. Although when not using the spear the throwing knives shall be useless. When using the spear they'll be highly effective. Throwing Knives beat the Spear for this factor. Also the fact that the Spear won't be very effective in combat against the Scimitar either.

I want to say that Hashashins did engage in upfront combat or else they wouldn't use a shield. On top of that, Germanic's didn't necessarily often go straight head to head. They always had the opponent dead before they even knew they were there. Put yourself in the shoes of a Roman. It's Sunday night, you aren't expecting an attack you're tired you can't wait for your shift to end. Then all of the sudden a bunch of ass holes in black come out of the bushes and start tearing up your guys. You're all like "WTF" you're looking around trying to see them but you can't see them, all you can see is your friends getting cut down. Now you're dealing with panic and sadness and anger of the loss of your friend and maybe commanding officer. Then next thing you know you've been stabbed in the neck. What I'm getting at is that most of the time the Germanic's opponents were dead before they even saw them. I mean, 2,500 of these fights will be at night, in the forests of Germania, squad on squad, so..........But the other 2,500 will be one on one in broad daylight in the town of Masyaf. I'm just saying that the Hashashins did engage in upfront combat and that the Germanic's weren't exactly mr. direct combat either.

Overall the Hashashin shall take this with better weapons, equal training, and the Germanic's being unfarmiliar with swords like the Scimitar.

Notes
*Votes with 4+ sentences that are all relevant and valid points will be counted as full. Anything under will not be counted at all.

*2,500 of these fights will be at night in the dark forests of Germania squad on quad. The other 2,500 in broad daylight one on one in the town of Masyaf.

<span style="background-color:rgb(0,0,0);">*Arguments count as votes.

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