User blog:SPARTAN 119/Courageous-class battlecruisers (Royal Navy) vs Deutschland-class armored cruiser (Kriegsmarine)

The Courageous-class, British "large light cruisers" designed to keep up with light cruisers, but carry massive guns usually seen on battleships

VS

The Deutschland-class, German "Panzerschiffe", heavily armed and armored cruisers known to the Allies as "pocket battleships".

Only one can be the DEADLIEST WAR MACHINE!

=Courageous-class=

The Courageous class consisted of three battlecruisers known as "large light cruisers" built for the Royal Navy during World War I. The class was nominally designed to support the Baltic Project, a plan by Admiral of the Fleet Lord Fisher that was intended to land troops on the German Baltic Coast. Ships of this class were fast but very lightly armoured, with only a few heavy guns. They were given a shallow draught, in part to allow them to operate in the shallow waters of the Baltic but also reflecting experience gained earlier in the war. To maximize their speed, the Courageous-class battlecruisers were the first capital ships of the Royal Navy to use geared steam turbines and small-tube boilers.

The first two ships, Courageous and Glorious, were commissioned in 1917 and spent the war patrolling the North Sea. They participated in the Second Battle of Heligoland Bight in November 1917 and were present when the High Seas Fleet surrendered a year later. Their half-sister Furious was designed with a pair of 18-inch (457 mm) guns, the largest guns ever fitted on a ship of the Royal Navy, but was modified during construction to take a flying-off deck and hangar in lieu of her forward turret and barbette. After some patrols in the North Sea, her rear turret was removed and another flight deck added. Her aircraft attacked the Zeppelin sheds during the Tondern raid in July 1918.

All three ships were laid up after the war, but were rebuilt as aircraft carriers during the 1920s. Glorious and Courageous were sunk early in World War II and Furious was sold for scrap in 1948. (From Wikipedia) =Deutschland-class= The Deutschland class was a series of three Panzerschiffe ("armored ships"), a form of heavily armed cruiser, built by the Reichsmarine officially in accordance with restrictions imposed by the Treaty of Versailles. The class, which comprised the ships Deutschland, Admiral Scheer, and Admiral Graf Spee, were all stated to displace 10,000 long tons (10,000 t) in accordance with the Treaty, though they actually displaced 10,600 to 12,340 long tons (10,770 to 12,540 t) at standard displacement. Despite violating the weight limitation, the design for the ships incorporated several radical innovations to save weight. They were the first major warships to use welding and all-diesel propulsion. Due to their heavy armament of six 28 cm (11 in) guns, the British began referring to the vessels as "pocket battleships". The Deutschland class ships were initially classified as Panzerschiffe or "armored ships", but the Kriegsmarine reclassified them as heavy cruisers in February 1940.

The three ships were built between 1929 and 1936 by the Deutsche Werke and Reichsmarinewerft in Kiel and Wilhelmshaven, respectively. They saw heavy service with the German Navy. All three vessels served on non-intervention patrols during the Spanish Civil War. While on patrol, Deutschland was attacked by Republican bombers, and in response, Admiral Scheer bombarded the port of Almería. In 1937, Admiral Graf Spee represented Germany at the Coronation Review for Britain's King George VI. For the rest of their peacetime careers, the ships conducted a series of fleet maneuvers in the Atlantic and visited numerous foreign ports in goodwill tours.

Before the outbreak of World War II, Deutschland and Admiral Graf Spee were deployed to the Atlantic to put them in position to attack Allied merchant traffic once war was declared. Admiral Scheer remained in port for periodic maintenance. Deutschland was not particularly successful on her raiding sortie, during which she sank or captured three ships. She then returned to Germany where she was renamed Lützow. Admiral Graf Spee sank nine vessels in the South Atlantic before she was confronted by three British cruisers at the Battle of the River Plate. Although she damaged the British ships severely, she was herself damaged and her engines were in poor condition. Coupled with false reports of British reinforcements, the state of the ship convinced Hans Langsdorff, her commander, to scuttle the ship outside Montevideo. (From Wikipedia) =Weapons=

4x 15-inch guns (Courageous) and 2x 18-inch guns (Furious)
The main battery of the Courageous-class differed between the Courageous and Glorious and the Furious. The Courageous and Glorious were armed with four BL Mk I 15-inch (381mm) guns in two twin turrets. These guns fired a 1,938 pound (879 kg) shell with a range of up to 30,680 meters. With her four 15 inch guns, the Courageous fired a broadside of 3156 kg (7752 lbs).

The HMS Furious carried two BL Mk. 1 18-inch (460mm) guns, the largest guns ever mounted on a British warship, and second only the Japanese 18.1-inch guns mounted on the battleships Yamato and Musashi. The Furious 18-inch guns were carried in two turrets, and has a maximum range of 37,000 meters, but an effective range of only 28,700 meters. The guns fired a 3,320 pound (1,510 kg) shell, giving the Furious' two guns a broadside of 3020 kg (6640 lbs). In real life, the Furious never fired her 18-inch guns in anger, being removed when she was converted into an aircraft carrier, however, they were transferred to two Lord Clive-class monitors and used to bombard a German-controlled bridge in World War I.

6x 280mm (11-inch) guns (Deutshland-class)
The three Deutschland class ships were armed with a main battery of six 28 cm SK C/28 guns mounted in two triple turrets, one on either end of the superstructure.[8] The turrets were the Drh LC/28 type and allowed elevation to 40 degrees,[14] and depression to −8 degrees.[8] This provided the guns with a maximum range of 36,475 m (119,669 ft). They fired a 300 kg (660 lb) projectile at a muzzle velocity of 910 meters per second (3,000 ft/s).

119's Edge
This one is not as simple as looks. While the British ships both carried heavier guns, the Deutschland-class carried more guns, which, I might add, would still have been capable of penetrating the Courageous-class armor. Even

18x 4-inch (102mm) guns (Courageous) or 11x 5.5-inch guns (Furious)
The Courageous-class ships were designed with 18 BL 4-inch Mark IX guns, fitted in six triple mounts. These were manually powered and quite cumbersome in use as they required a crew of thirty-two men to load and train the guns. The gun's rate of fire was only 10 to 12 rounds per minute as the loaders kept getting in each other's way. They had a maximum depression of −10° and a maximum elevation of 30°. They fired a 22-pound (10.0 kg) high explosive shell at a muzzle velocity of 2,625 ft/s (800 m/s). At maximum elevation the guns had a maximum range of 13,500 yards (12,344 m). The ships carried 120 rounds for each gun.

Furious's secondary armament consisted of 11 BL 5.5-inch Mk I guns. The guns had a maximum elevation of 25° on their pivot mounts. They fired 82-pound (37 kg) projectiles at a muzzle velocity of 2,790 ft/s (850 m/s) at a rate of 12 rounds per minute. Their maximum range was 16,000 yd (15,000 m) at 25° elevation.

8x 150mm guns (Deutschland-class)
The secondary battery comprised eight 15 cm SK C/28 guns, each in single MPLC/28 mountings arranged amidships. These mountings allowed elevation to 35 degrees and depression to −10 degrees, for a range of 25,700 m (84,300 ft). They were supplied with a total of 800 rounds of ammunition, though later in their careers this was increased to 1,200 rounds. These shells weighed 45.3 kg (100 lb) and had a muzzle velocity of 875 m/s (2,870 ft/s). (From Wikipedia)

119's Edge
Initially, it may appear that the Courageous-class get the edge with their greater number of guns, however, this is not the case. The Deutschland-class's eight 150mm (5.9 inch) guns had a much greater range, twice that of the Furious' 5.5 inch guns, and fired a shell twice as large. Placing: First: Deutschland-class, Second: Furious, Third: Courageous

2x 21-inch torpedo tubes
The Courageous-class battlecruisers carried two submerged 21-inch torpedo tubes, one on each side, near the A-turret (front turret). The would have probably used Mark II torpedoes, with a 4.1km range at 45 knots, and 7.13 km range at 35 knots. The torpedo had a 400-515 lb warhead.

8x 21-inch (533mm) torpedo tubes
The ship carried a powerful weapon in the form of eight torpedo tubes in two four-shot deck-mounted launchers. These weapons fired the G7a torpedo, the standard issue torpedo on early-war German U-boats and surface ships. The weapon was an unguided torpedo with a speed of 30 knots and a maximum range of 12 kilometers.

119's Edge
The German torpedo tubes have a longer range and more tubes, meaning a faster rate of fire. Edge:Deutschland-class

=Statistics=

Explanations
In terms of firepower on an individual gun basis (see above), as well as the weight of shells in a broadside (also above), the main guns British ships take a definite edge. However, in terms of rate of fire (more guns=more shots before reload) and reserve ammunition, the Deutschland-class takes the edge. The German 11-inch guns also had a longer range than either of the British guns. On the other hand, in terms of armor, the Courageous-class has similar minimum armor to the Deutschland-class, but greater maximum armor- typically on the turrets and superstructure. The British also take an edge in terms of top speed, with a two-knot advantage over the Germans.

119's Edge
=Scenario= The battle will take place on the open ocean, in clear conditions. The British forces will consist of the HMS Courageous (4x 15 inch guns) and the HMS Furious (2x 18-inch guns). The German forces will consists of the two Deutshland-class cruisers (like most vessels of the same class, they will be identically armed- in this case with 6x11 inch guns). The ships will sight each other at a range of 40 km/40,000 meters- just beyond the range of both their guns, and will maneuver in to into range and attack. The ship's captains will make any maneuver they consider necessary to gain an advantage, including those which would separate the two ships in the force. Ships will be able to see torpedoes incoming and will attempt to evade them. The ships' crews, officers, and captains on both sides will, for the purpose of this match, will be highly trained, experienced, and familiar with their respective ships and their capabilities.
 * Armor: Courageous-class
 * Individual gun firepower: Courageous-class
 * Broadside: Courageous-class
 * Main Gun Range: Deutschland-class
 * Shots before Reload:Deutschland-class
 * Top Speed:Courageous-class